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Archive 01 - May 25, 2006 - July 13, 2006 (Approximate)

More Cleanup?

What else can be done to clean up this page? Any suggestions? --Señor Eko 09:07, 25 July 2006 (PDT)

  • Please remove this tripe from the Trivia section: "A yoga instructor's random bit trivia: Dharma Mittra, creator the the famous 908 yoga poses chart and guru in NYC, is originally from Brazil and speaks Portuguese, same as mysterious duo. Also, the farewell of Nameste at the ending of the orientations is a bizzare yoga connection."

Done and done --Señor Eko 10:53, 3 August 2006 (PDT)

  • Although this is a dual episode, the synopsis is far too long, especially now that we have full transcripts. Either shorten the synopsis, or add a "summary" or "abstract" section with a 2 or 3 short-paragraph piece of text. -- Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  Talk 02:32, 17 September 2006 (PDT)

The Timing of the Discharge?

I've been wondering if the timing of the Discharge event is known for certain. When the bright light and noise end, is this 20 or so seconds after the turning of the key, as we see it, or does it coincide exactly with Desmonde turning the key? Loki 23:14, 26 July 2006 (PDT)

It effected different parts of the island at diferent times. Closer=Earlier Farther=Later.--CaptainInsano

rewriting

Changing to past tense, trying a new sectioned (numbered) format for the flashbacks, and reducing length as a whole for conciseness. A synopsis should be a summary, not an exhaustive paraphrasing of the transcript; some things can and should be omitted. Will continue over the next few days. -- Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  Talk  21:04, 17 January 2007 (PST)

  • My first impression of the numbers: The numbered paragraphs look strange to me. I thought they were typos at first. What do they signify?--Dagg 06:05, 18 January 2007 (PST)
    • I gotta agree, I thought we'd agreed to ditch the "FLASHBACK 1" things at the start of paragraphs and use prose instead. Also, the tense is different to how we normally write episode reviews. I honestly can't be bothered caring much, but please just tell me whats happening now for when I rewrite more articles so I know how everyone else wants them to be formatted. Personally, I preferred the old way like on Maternity Leave, as its easier to read than pictures every line messing up the justification - but thats just my opinion, and I'll follow whatever consensus is reached --Nickb123 (Talk) 03:45, 23 January 2007 (PST)
      • It's way too messy and alot harder to find infomation needed. I dont get the Numbered paragraphs in the flashback, what are they for? --   Dee4leeds  talk  contribs  all  07:34, 23 January 2007 (PST)
        • I rewrited "Realtime events" and put them into present tense (If i missed something, please fix it) Jakovexc0

The Red Things

When Jack, Kate and so on are on the Pala Ferry some of the others are holding some red things in there hands and I want to know what they are... -- PROJECTX23

Maybe they're the "Tazers" used in Season 3? CJDTrismegistus

Date of flashback scene

I dont know if determining the date that elizabeth met desmond is importand or not but the banknotes that he has in his wallet are british £5 notes issued after may 2002 --TimmyWimmy 12:31, 29 August 2006 (PDT)

Probably an crew error. Since he was suppose to be there for 3 years. The crash happened in 2004. 2004-3=2001.--CaptainInsano 12:33, 29 August 2006 (PDT)

The Discharge & "I think we found it."

In the AH part of the Sri Lanka Video, it was mentioned about changing the core values of the Valenzetti Equation, and perhaps the discharge has. Hence, the guys at the listening post phoned PW to tell her that the inhabitants of the island have found a way to change the values. --5-8-15-16-23-42 04:29, 1 October 2006 (PDT)

No, Penelope had them posted there to find Desmond, not changing the Valenzetti equation. Also, TLE has no impact on events in Lost according to the producers, things out of TLE aren't going to be the basis of any story in Lost.
Unless you think that the producers are willing to change a perfectly good reason for Penelope and the Listening Station, change the infamous numbers, and alienate a large % of the viewers by betraying them with TLE stuff, it is as likely to happen as "Henry" marrying Sayid. --The Smiley-Faced Balloon 04:32, 1 October 2006 (PDT)

"1bbybby 77111790" - Unlikely to be significant, but it's surely no coincidence that the first half of this fragment of the terminal text looks a lot like "Libby". Fatcatfan 13:29, 17 October 2006 (PDT)


January 2007 cleanup

  • OK I finished a first draft of cleanup. This is what it used to look like, take a look and actually try to read the whole thing. I couldn't. The reason it's bloated is because the synopsis is a paraphrasing of the transcript, only with less details and less accurate, but retaining the disadvantage of jumping from location to location to follow each shot in the order it was broadcast.
    Changes: 1) past tense, 2) conciseness edits: remove quotations, remove excessive descriptions, remove minor details (that were taken from the transcript but have not place in a synopsis), 3) number the flashback scenes. I felt I had to do this since flashback, by definition, do not form a continuous narrative-- each flashback is a different unrelated scene (as opposed to realtime island events, which can continue between scenes. 4) combined the realtime island events, even from nonconsecutive shots, as long as they occurred in the same day (or similar), as well as illustrating each with a screencap.
    It's still a bit long for a synopsis for some tastes, but since this is a double episode, I figured that was fine.
-- Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  Talk  02:16, 20 January 2007 (PST)
  • Wonderful job you did. Only thing is, I'm still not crazy about the numbering (and some get blocked out anyway when the pictures on the left); but the content itself was condensed very well. Thank you for your time. --PandoraX 07:08, 23 January 2007 (PST)
Please see above for my comments, under the "rewrite" subheading. Basically the same thing, just that I prefer prose to numbers and think pictures should be like they usually are, as having many pics messes up alignment and makes reading the actual article more difficult. Also there's the issue of tense consistency - but otherwise yes a better written article --Nickb123 (Talk) 07:21, 23 January 2007 (PST)
Also, my issue against tense is that past tense is less powerful when describing the events IMO. My idea of a good episode article would be Adrift, or Maternity Leave - a good compromise between both different styles would be good --Nickb123 (Talk) 07:51, 23 January 2007 (PST)
I agree about the numbering. The numbers are bad. --   Jabberwock    talk    contribs    email   - 07:59, 23 January 2007 (PST)


Discussion: Current "image-flooded" look

I just passed by this page lately, and I really acknowledge all the hard work and input that was paid here to get this article together, and dramatically improve its organization..However, I really wonder why is there sooo many pictures in this article ? Do we really need this amount of images? Also, why are the images mostly not in thumb form ? To be honest, I like the content, but IMHO really see no point of all these non-thumb images, which is a clear inconsistency to the rest of episodes we have around. I have noticed that this article is currently nominated for a featured article, which if wins would even increase the already existing danger of motivating editors to imitate its look, which I'm not sure if all approves of..I would like to hear your thoughts guys ? -- 18:58, 29 January 2007 (PST)

Maybe the article looks different on Santa's monitor? I'm trying to read this article at 1024x768 on a smallish laptop, and the text is fairly unreadable. The margin at the left side jumps around every 2-3 sentences, and sometimes only one or two words wrap around and are shown underneath of the image. It basically looks like this:
+--------+ Text text text text text text text text
|        | Text text text text ... text text text
+--------+ .. Text text text text text end of 
paragraph.
+----+ Text text text text text text text text text
|    | .. Text text text text text text text text
|    | ... Text text text text test text text text.
+----+ Text text text text text text text end of
paragraph.
And then all the paragraphs in the Realtime
events
section are indented, which again changes the
left margin. I guess I'm not used
to the left
margin changing for every paragraph. -- Dagg talk contribs4 8 22:41, 29 January 2007 (PST)
  • Could be browser width, especially if wide, but it's a valid point. Right justification should help. -- Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  Talk  23:34, 29 January 2007 (PST)
  • OK made that change, and I agree it is for the better. There is still a bad interaction with the episode infobox on the right side; if someone could toss the article content of each section into a discrete 1-column table to hold it, that should help. -- Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  Talk  23:42, 29 January 2007 (PST)

Discussion: Previous "text-flooded" look

  • Synopses were previously problematic (play-by-play paraphrasing of transcript-level detail); it was unreadable (try to read it from end to end here if you want to try actually reading the whole thing), especially in light of the existence of a transcript, which is the better alternative; a synopsis is a summary digest. The content of synopses were rendered to be more concise, and separated by scene, which made this double-length episode more digestible. These scenes were numbered as an experiment, but immediately previous discussion indicated that numbers were not desirable. The numbering was replaced by mini images. In short, the images each denote a scene, rather than being random decoration for the article. The images are small because they are being used in this different way. In this way, the previously unmanageable length of the synopsis (of this double episode) is now essentially indexed by scene. An alternative would be to format the synopsis as a table, which is a format where images seem to be more prevalent in Lostpedia. Much of this formatting was done before, and in response to, the comments on the AOTW page that you cite. -- Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  Talk  19:43, 29 January 2007 (PST)
  • Furthermore, a growing consensus seem to be that episode articles here in Lostpedia are (still) in sore need of attention. Some solution is merited, and the status quo is not desirable (in addition to the tense issue, which is being discussed elsewhere). Regarding your use of negatively loaded descriptions: Your opinion is that the look is "image-flooded", and I propose that it is not, due to the fact that the images are not merely decoration (In which case it would be over-deocration) in light of their utilitarian scene-labeling function and small size. I'd further claim that the past look was "text-flooded". What I ask of editors who are offering opinions on this matter, rather than look briefly at the images then decide, try making a sandbox edit, then try to to actually and honestly read the synopsis from end to end as a usability test.-- Contrib¯ _Santa_ ¯  Talk  19:47, 29 January 2007 (PST)

The Pictures

No other article has a format like this one. The words need to be severally cut down and the pictures need to be formatted like the rest of the site. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Quint (talkcontribs) .

Agree I agree completely, I don't like the picture format --Mr. Crabby (Talk) 08:53, 24 February 2007 (PST)

  • Fixed pictures (put them into thumbs). Jakovexc0

Receptionist

Just out of interest, who was the receptionist in the episode? I don't recall seeing any kind of receptionist. >: 4 8 15 16 23 42 12:19, 9 March 2007 (PST)

Whom did Sawyer shoot?

I'm sure it's been asked before, but the guy Sawyer shot in the jungle, from the one glance we got, looked kinda like Wickmund/Candle. Thoughts? JoelVanAtta 20:16, 5 April 2007 (PDT)

Answer to Unanswered Question: "Why did Desmond not remember the first system failure until it was too late?"

He does remember. But he's not sure if it really was him stopping the System Failure or if it just stopped itself, which would make it unreal too. Also he's not sure if all that shaking actually does harm and "destroys the world" as often mentioned before. Then, reading the logs, he figures that it all does effect things outside of The Swan and that it probably really was him stopping the System Failure.

Episode Number

This is actually 2 episodes, aired at the same time, and is billed as episode 23 and 24 (see: http://www.epguides.com/lost/). Should the opening sentence reflect that? I understand that having one article for the episode(s) makes sense -- but I still feel it should be mentioned. I raise this issue as I'm going through the episodes from S02 onwards and adding what episode number (overall) it is, and I wasn't sure what to do here.

(Also, unrelated to this -- the text on this talk page is huge, some kind of CSS error?) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by BauerUK (talkcontribs) .

Text fixed, cause: faulty sig. --Blueeagleislander 03:22, 27 October 2008 (PDT)

Incorrect links

Some of the links on this and some previous pages are incorrect(assuming), if i press "Coincidence" link i am ending up in "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coincidence" which it should be "http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Coincidence".

After computer smashed...

After Locke smash the computer into floor, Desmond acting like it's end of the "pushing button", but as a person who knows about computers, i am pretty sure what Locke threw was a monitor(the device that just show numbers, characters, maybe pictures) not the main device which desmond shot by an accident in "Orientation", we can easily assume the numbers still enterable to computer, and of course Desmond character with no "proved" electronic or electric experience may think it's not possible to enter any numbers. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 92.45.222.173 (talkcontribs) .

Rename

Per the new press releases, episode 5x14 is the 100th episode special. Therefore this counts as 2 episodes, and should be either split up or renamed accordingly. --Pyramidhead 03:04, 20 March 2009 (UTC)

  • AGREED Even Disc 6 of the Season Two DVDs declares (on the disc itself) that the DVD contains "Episodes 21-24". On the Episodes menu, only three episodes are listed -- "?" "Three Minutes" and "Live Together, Die Alone" -- but for there to be episodes 21-24 on the disc, it means "Live Together, Die Alone" is seen as two different episodes, spliced together. It's #2x23 and #2x24 according to the disc. I vote we change the Lostpedia page accordingly. I realize a lot of people won't want to do this (because it means we've been counting wrong for three years), but it's better to change the mistake now, then let it live on forever. Marc604 06:30, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
  • I'm thinking this is merely the 100th episode for the purposes of syndication (which goes by individual hours). User were always aware that there are several different ways to divide up the episodes, and for whatever reason they chose the particular method they chose. It's not like they weren't aware before that you could divide up the episodes in this way, they simply chose another way. There's no reason to suddenly change course now. --Jackdavinci 04:04, 20 March 2009 (UTC)
  • Split: it would be best if we slit this article into LTDA Part 1 and LTDA Part 2. This would be the best way to refer to them as separate episodes. -- CTS  Talk   Contribs 23:59, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
  • No. It should not be split. Sure, it takes up two episodes in syndication (and that's what ABC is counting), but it aired as a single episode and that's all that matters. Same with the name. --Golden Monkey 16:53, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
    • "Because You Left" and "The Lie" aired together as well, and on the version available from iTunes (not sure about the broadcast version) "Because You Left" does not have ending credits; it leads right into "The Lie". This is also true for TNPLH Parts 2 & 3, which you obviously consider only one episode based on the way it aired. Are you suggesting we merge "Because You Left" and "The Lie" into one article as well? Didn't think so. They should be split.--Sloth 04:57, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
      • Please understand the difference between "counting as two episodes" and "splitting into two articles". 5x01 and 5x02 aired on the same night, they didn't air as one episode. The other examples (Exodus Part 2, LTDA, TTLG, and There's No Place Like Home 2&3) can be counted as multiple episodes but the articles should remain together.  Jimbo the Tubby  talk  contributions  05:06, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
On the ABC website, Live Together, Die Alone has two different Previously on Lost's, two different guest casts, and two different Lost title sequences. That alone is enough to justify splitting this page up. --Pyramidhead 23:17, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
The ABC episode player lists it as ONE episode though (unlike Through the Looking Glass which it shows as two parts). Also, the DVD says Lve Together, Die Alone is one episode. -- CTS  Talk   Contribs 23:24, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
Regardless, if we're going to be as accurate as possible, we need to reflect that these are basically two episodes with different casts rather than bunching it all together as we have unitl now. --Pyramidhead 00:03, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I know, but I find it strange that ABC and the DVDs have "Live Together, Die Alone, Part 1" listed as one episode and "Through the Looking Glass, Part 2" listed as two. -- CTS  Talk   Contribs 00:06, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I'd just like to say that here in Europe, all of the finales are split into parts on the DVDs :)--Baker1000 00:08, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
I agree, it's strange. Given that they can't seem to keep it straight even among themselves, here's how I think we should handle this: If a two-parter was ever aired with two separate "LOST" titles and different casts (as with LTDA), they should be made into two separate episodes. Otherwise (Exodus, TTLG, TNPLH), we keep the existing article, but acknowledge that it technically counts as 2 episodes in one. This way, 5x14 is still #100, and we're being as consistent as possible with what we've been given. --Pyramidhead 00:10, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Wait, now I'm confused. LTDA aired as one episode, just like TTLG and TNPLHP2&3. -- CTS  Talk   Contribs 00:19, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Don't split: The episodes were aired as one, and are represented as one. One ABC press release should not change the facts that we've known for several years...that "Live Together, Die Alone, Part 1", "Through the Looking Glass, Part 1", and "There's No Place Like Home, Part 2" each count as one collective episode. -- Sam McPherson  T  C  E  00:21, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
Actually, it should change the facts, because this is the first time we've gotten a conclusive statement on episode numbering from an official source. While we can keep the single articles for the 2-parters (with the exception of LTDA for reasons stated above), each one must count as two episodes sharing the same title. --Pyramidhead 02:09, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
But why should LTDA be split and TTLG shouldn't? Both of them aired as one episode, and ABC counts TTLG as a two-parter but LTDA as one. -- CTS  Talk   Contribs 02:10, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
So far as I know, LTDA is the only one that shows the cast credits and the "LOST" title at the start of each half, and the guest stars are different - Alan Dale is listed as being in the first half and not the second, etc. As I said, that's more than enough to give them their own pages. The rest credit the guest cast for the whole two hours and have no such break - the second half of TTLG goes straight into the action with no recap, title, etc. Same with Exodus and TNPLH. --Pyramidhead 06:42, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Can we come to a consensus before we start splitting it? It seems like it's fairly evenly split at the moment and nobody has given a good reason for why we need two articles even if we count them as multiple episodes (like TNPLH Parts 2&3 currently is).  Jimbo the Tubby  talk  contributions  03:38, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Yes, let's come to a concensus. I vote to SPLIT. The future of Lost is NOT how it aired on television on one specific day -- the future IS in syndication and IS in the DVDs. If 5x14 is the 100th episode, then at Lostpedia we owe it to every Lost fan to ensure that we have 99 episode pages preceding it. It's as simple as that. Marc604 11:35, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Agree I agree we need to come to a consensus first and i couldnt agree more with mark604 if abc counts it as 100 episodes then the finales should be 2 episodes like he said in 30 years people arent going to care how the episodes aired. --Czygan84 21:14, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

This discussion is currently happening in about 5 or 6 pages. Please continue it here so that we can get everyone in a single spot.  Jimbo the Tubby  talk  contributions  05:02, 25 March 2009 (UTC)

The Meeting of Desmond and Kelvin

The Bloopers and Continuity Errors section states: 'The meeting of Desmond and Kelvin Inman seems to be inconsistent with the one described by Desmond in "Orientation"'

Having watched both of these episodes fairly recently, I can't seem to think of any way in which the two are inconsistent. Is this alleged blooper correct (or is this a case of someone claiming a continuity error because what happened in this episode wasn't what they personally pictured during Orientation)? Can anyone specify exactly what the continuity error is? If not, this should be removed.--Faraday100 04:10, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

> because what happened in this episode wasn't what they personally pictured

Lol... I agree.--Snake78 05:08, 31 July 2009 (UTC)

Since no one has put forth what exactly is different between the meeting of Desmond and Kelvin as shown here and as described in Orientation, I am removing that entry. If someone plans to repost it, please be specific... it's not enough to suggest there's a blooper or continuity error in a given scene, you have to say what it is.--Faraday100 23:36, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

rewind

ok, There are four or five characters that may be considered the heroes of LOST. Sawyer is parody of jack. everything sawyer is; jack is not, BUT JACK LEARNS FROM SAWYER. Faraday's targets are Jacob and MiB. His parody is Locke. Locke chooses to die, but Ben upsets his plan. Faraday dies, but Desmond continues to play Faraday's part. Faraday turns him on and off. The brilliant device of making reappear in Flashsideways. But he emerges from the other side of the field. Unlike 316, he does not reject his role. he is there at the End to stop her in her tracks. His final messageis the same in both instances, I am not on your side. In Living Together.... he enters a new maze like one of Faraday's rats. he escapes from that maze, disappears until LAX. But how many mazes has Desmond run. There was the monastery, the military, prison, the boat race. He is the hero with a thousand tasks. His life seems more the Labors of Hercules. And for what purpose. It's for our mutual friend and benefactor Jack. Among all his labors, one thing becomes clear in this episode. He is there to help Jack. when jack has other teachers, esp. Sawyer, he is absent. When jack seems to falters, he is there. He is there to block Ben, to nudge Hurley, to fulfill jack's wish to make Locke walk (impossible except in an unreal world). He is jack's constant. Faraday's subtle use of Desmond in season 6 shows how far Faraday has advanced as a manipulator. The only full scene that faraday has since "his death" is with desmond.--Past recaptured 21:41, September 15, 2010 (UTC)