Horace's Status needs to be changed
Why is his status still dead, and not changed to alive in the past? Most other DHARMA characters have had their status changed including Pierre Chang, why not Horace? If everyone agrees, i think it should be changed. --Nzoomed 21:53, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
- Nope, Horace is dead. The Other DHARMA people are also dead, but if you're right that Chang is listed as alive, that's inaccurate. He should be listed as "Unknown." Marc604 08:53, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
It may just be an ordinary prop, but Horace's medallion may be a clue either to his nature, or to his work on the Initiative. --ConspiracyofDetails 06:34, 10 May 2007 (PDT)
I find it interesting that he is an mathematician but wears an Arrow station jumpsuit. The Arrow was supposedly a staging and warehouse station. Seems like a waste of talent, but maybe the Arrow will be revealed as something more important. --aericina 10:54, 10 May 2007 (EDT)
- So far, several "secret passages" and other openings have been found, notably the reinforced hidden entrance to the ultrasound room in the Staff. It is possible that a similar "secret passage" opens itno the true working areas of the Arrow. --ConspiracyofDetails 09:50, 11 May 2007 (PDT)
I believe it is implied by the writers that Horace is married to Olivia. After the purge his wedding ring can be seen:
--Stan 08:30, 10 May 2007 (PDT)
Anyone else find it strange how Ben seemed shocked/surprised when he saw Horace dead? It's almost like he cared about him. Born Acorn 13:34, 10 May 2007 (PDT)
- Ben was very careful to close Horace's eyes, and only his. --ConspiracyofDetails 09:50, 11 May 2007 (PDT)
- This also begs the question of whether or not Horace ended up in the mass grave with the other DHARMAs. --ConspiracyofDetails 11:52, 11 May 2007 (PDT)
- Some of you, and even the article, seem to put too much emphasis on the closing of the eyes. How it struck me is that Ben just went through a major change in his life. Imagine growing up in a closed community and then conpiring against them all, leading to their deaths. Ben closed his eyes because it was the end of the life as he knew it and the beginning of something else, as he hoped, greater. The "shocked/surpised look" is simply that, the shocking realization that he's done something big. Why Horace? Maybe because he's the reason Ben's even on the Island. Maybe because he's a familiar, and friendly, face. Maybe just because he was in the right spot at the right time. Maybe all three. -- macosx 01:22, 29 May 2007 (PDT)
Maybe so, but remember that a very large part of Ben's life was not in that flashback. When he is returned to, I think his relationship with Horace will be expanded upon. Or, it won't - either way we'll know whether it's a useful question or not.
As an aside, it's worth bearing in mind that he killed his father and left him in a jungle to rot, whilst he walked over to this man and closed his eyes. I think that alone is suggestive, but I shan't speculate. --Ragnor 12:04, 30 May 2007 (PDT)
Anyone has noticed that, like Richard Alpert, also Horace didn't age? It was first seen as Ben was born, then in The purge, but he looks almost the same after roughly 30 years. Is it possible that all the Hostile do not age? Is Horace an Hostile? This could help explaining why Ben is so careful in his respect.--Cclerici 16:35, 31 August 2007 (PDT)
I find it interesting that we have Horace Goodspeed of the DI and Goodwin of the others. I wonder what Darlton are trying to tell us? --Scottyus 22:47, 13 May 2008 (PDT)
Also along the line of names, "Horace" and "Horus" could possibly be more significant than just a namesake. I think that this is different than when the writers reference philosophers and such for character names, mainly because in this case, there is the Eye of Horus in Jacob's weaving, but there is no direct reference in the show to the actual philosophers/scientists/etc. that the characters are named after. And on the humorous side, if it were Horace's glass eye in The Arrow (he did wear an Arrow patch), then it would be the "Eye of Horace"--Nrdk0r 12:36, 11 July 2009 (CST)
Reason for Ben closing his eyes - is it really an unanswered question?
I for one thought there was one reason for Ben's special tenderness toward Horace's corpse which was fairly evident in light of the previous flashback sequences in that episode. Horace always seemed to offer Ben the fatherly kindness he was starved for and deprived of by his actual father. When young Ben and dad are arriving on the island, Roger appears rather sour-faced and belittling toward Ben ("he doesn't talk much"), while Horace from the very get-go offers the lonely and awkward kid kind words of encouragement and ease. Later on, Horace takes an interest in Ben's education and seems to honestly care about his well-being; while Roger responds to that by bluntly confessing that he doesn't really give a damn about Ben's future. With all this in mind, no wonder adult Ben would feel at least some remorse that his acts against Dharma ended up also costing this man's life, who's always been kind and generous toward him. --Boyen 15:42, 26 September 2007 (PDT)
- I always figured Ben paid Horace the respect of closing his eyes, and only him, because without Horace Ben may have never come to the Island. What you said plus what I believe, well, we can see why he felt something for ol' Goodspeed. The-room 23:31, 2 May 2008 (PDT)
- Horace also seemed to care for Ben, and was friendly to him from what we've seen in "The Man Behind the Curtain." Maybe Ben looked at him as a true parent because we all know that Ben's dad was awful to him. Marko 13:57, 7 May 2008 (PDT)
Horace built Jacob's Cabin
I don't think there is a basis for this assumption. Locke saw him in a dream, he said he was building it for him and his wife, and he didn't even look like he was getting anywhere chopping that tree down over and over. Kajillion 00:44, 9 May 2008 (PDT)
- Locke found the blueprints for building the cabin on Horace's corpse. Sometimes a blueprint is just a blueprint. I'm putting this back. Boloboffin 05:03, 9 May 2008 (PDT)
In the scene where Goodspeed is seen cutting down a tree in Cabin Fever, only to have the tree appear uncut - before it was revealed that this was a dream, my initial thought was not that this was punishment for Goodspeed (because, what did he do wrong) - but merely, an allusion to possible time fluctuations on the island. Why would Goodspeed be punished with a sisyphus type punishment? It's more likely that it is a reference to some temporal loop of the island. --LOSTinDC 13:33, 9 May 2008 (PDT)
- Agreed. This is a kind of obtuse and overly esoteric reference. I was surprised to see it there. It should be deleted. It's tantamount to quoting the legend of Paul Bunyan's axe here, since Horace was using an axe. --Vic Coutin 09:55, 10 May 2008 (PDT)
- Yes, LOSTinDC, it could be a reference to time fluctuations but it just as well could be a reference to Sisyphus, and it might be a reference to both - there not mutually exclusive after all. But I saw it and thought of Sisyphus; here's why - Goodspeed is spending his afterlife (he said he died years ago - hence "afterlife") doing the same activity, cutting down a tree, over-and-over-and-over again. Each time he completes his task, it begins again, seemingly forever. We don't know if this is some form of punishment (it may be, it may not) but I don't see how that matters. The core of the myth is about spending ones eternity repeating the same arduous task. Thus the scene between Goodspeed and Locke references this myth - it may not be the only reference in the scene, it may not be the best reference in the scene, but the reference is there... And, VicCountin, this is by no means the most "obtuse and overly esoteric reference" in Lost. The writers seem to have a special place in their hearts for references that are especially obtuse and esoteric. How may people had heard of "The Third Policeman" before it poped up on the Lost radar? How many people knew that the 17th Century philosopher John Locke was tutored by the nobleman Anthony Cooper until they did a little Lost-motivated research. And likening it to the myth of Paul Bunyan is not valid, because the scene's likeness to the Bunyan-myth is only "skin-deep" as it were (in that, as you point out, both have a axe). As I stated above, and unlike your example, I see in this scene the core of the Sisyphus myth beneath its skin, which is, again, spending ones eternity repeating the same arduous task. Again, it may not be the only reference in the scene, nor may it be the best reference on can find within it, but I think it is definetly there... Thanks --Qwerty7412369 01:47, 11 May 2008 (PDT)
Could Horace's nosebleed indicate that he's become "unstuck" in time? In retrospect this seems a little odd. --Doc 16:52, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
I don't see how. If you think about how ben killed his dad with the cannister and everyone in the barracks are lying down without apparent distress or signs of a fight and richard appears with a gas mask, its kind of easy to tell that Horace was just simply gassed to death, one of the side effects being severe nose bleeds as you inhale, as evident with Roger Linus. Squee!
Horace is mated to Olivia Goodspeed in the 1960s (when we see them at Ben's birth), but is mated to Amy when we see him in 1974 in LaFleur. What changed? Perhaps a new unanswered question--something along the lines of "Why is Horace mated to Olivia in the 1960s but mated to Amy in the 1970s?" --Snorklewacker 04:09, 5 March 2009 (UTC)
- He wasn't "mated" to Amy until 1977. In 1974 Amy was "mated" to Paul until his death.--Mikeholczer 02:48, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
Is there any real indication that Olivia and Horace were married? Perhaps he was just enlisting Olivia to join Dharma when he ran into the Linus'. --Ortrules 14:43, 5 March 2009 (UTC)
Regarding Horace / Horace's son beeing Jacob, that seems hardly likely. We know Jacob already existed in 1954, judging from Richard's reaction to Locke's "Jacob sends me"...
- Though I think we should change Amy's status from his partner to his wife because he is clearly refered to as her husband. --Orhan94 20:43, 5 March 2009 (UTC)
Was anyone able to read was was written under his name on the jumpsuit he wears in 1974/1977?--Mikeholczer 02:50, 12 March 2009 (UTC)
Horace has only met Jin, Miles, Daniel, Sawyer, Juliet, Ben and Sayid.
Robert H 14.03, 26 March
- It says "Mathmatician", just like all the other times we've seen it. --LOST-The Cartographer 14:35, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Purge Death Pic?
Anyone have the picture of Horace dead on the bench? Maybe with Ben closing his eyes? It'd fit perfect under the "Later Years" section. Marc604 11:02, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
He wasn't the leader of the DI, but of security, right? Iamlost23 15:21, May 2, 2010 (UTC)
- No, Horace was the top DI guy on the island, not just security. James "Sawyer" Ford, known as Jim LaFleur to DI in 1974-1977, is probably most associated with being head of DHARMA security. Paul (DHARMA Initiative) preceded LaFleur as head of Security. He was killed by Others and replaced by LaFleur. I think that's how it went down. Hatchbanger 15:26, May 2, 2010 (UTC)
- You've got it Hatch. Horace identifies himself as leader when he first meets Sawyer, and Radzinsky acknowledges this as well later on. --LOST-The Cartographer 17:32, May 2, 2010 (UTC)
- Thank you both. :) Iamlost23 23:38, May 2, 2010 (UTC)
Additionally it is clear that Horace oversaw security on the Island and in particular strategies for combating the Hostiles. We know that he was in command of the Arrow which was the research station responsible for developing countermeasures against the Hostiles, and that Sawyer reported to Horace.00:13, May 3, 2010 (UTC)